Forum:The case of Qua is now on trial by the community

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Forums: Index > Village Dump > The case of Qua is now on trial by the community
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Ladies and gents,

A decision needs to be taken regarding our friend SU182/NXWave - which most of you know, as of today, by the name of Qua.

For those who don't know the man, a brief history:

SU182 (Talk • Contribs (del) • Editcount • Block (rem-lst-all) • Logs • Groups) was a troll that indefbanned after a short stay in the Uncyclopedia. NXWave (Talk • Contribs (del) • Editcount • Block (rem-lst-all) • Logs • Groups) was another alias of him, to later join the site. At the time he was pretty helpful, won all audio related prizes and did a lot of good work. However, at some point he got obsessed with AE (Talk • Contribs (del) • Editcount • Block (rem-lst-all) • Logs • Groups) for some reason, and turned his life to hell. He was warned, repeatedly, and was banned several times until he finally got indefbanned by me after threatning on ban patrol to "do something extreme if he gets banned". He later admitted to be SU182 as well.

I have to say at this point that I got some emails from NXWave asking me to unban him and he was, nothing less than deranged, in my humble opinion.


A Later confirmed sock of him, Insignia (Talk • Contribs (del) • Editcount • Block (rem-lst-all) • Logs • Groups) managed to run off AE, AE left and never came back.

Other confirmed socks are:

I had my suspicions about Qua for a while, and a checkuser verified it today.


So, the case we need to decide it like this:

We have a repeating user who now evaded bans for 5 times, which by itself constitutes as a violation of acceptable behavior around here. Also, two of his aliases actively harassed, threatened and ran off at least one good (very good in fact) user off the site.

On the other hand, he made good contributions as well with his last two couple of socks (and with his primary account as NXWave before he flipped) - and did a good work.

Question is this: should we allow him to keep his current account while keeping a close eye on him or should we ban this one as well?

I'd like everyone who is about to vote on this to make sure they read through the history of this whole issue - and not regard him just as "Qua". This guy has a history. Also, if we do decide to unban him, we are setting a precedence that any vandal can return, as long as he nags us enough, take that under consideration as well.

I've blocked him for a week, during which we'll let the community decide. I won't take a vote since I was to involved in this whole issue.

One last note, whatever happens, he is not getting the NOTM, he is by far not a noob.

Let's make a decision. ~Jewriken.GIF 15:49, 23 June 2008 (UTC)

Contents

Stays, but with UN:OFFICE rules

Score: +10
  • I say he stays, but with a very, very strict entry into Flammable's Office. This would be the first time that we've given him a chance while knowing who he really is. If he screws this up, he's out for good. However, if he can manage to stay civil and avoid freaking out like he did with all his other socks, I think he should stay. He's been helpful as Qua, maybe he can keep it that way. Captain Sig_pic.PNG Mindless drivel Pointless edits 16:03, 23 June 2008 (UTC)
  • I agree with Boomer, to the letter. Don't talk to him like he's under surveillance, but keep an eye on his contribs for a week or two. If he screws up again, he's gone, but at least let him try to be productive. - Don Leddy the Crunch (Nyah, see, nyah!) 16:15, Jun 23
  • I think he should be allowed to stay, but he should not be allowed to become involved in any conflicts (i.e. revert wars, flamewars on VFH/VFD/forums, etc.) under penalty of a one-week ban per infraction, a month and a half for every three infractions, and an infinite ban for any ban evasion. --Sir Starnestommy Image:Icons-flag-us.png (Talk • Contribs • CUN) 16:25, Jun. 23, 2008
I'm abstaining until I have come up with a decision. --Sir Starnestommy Image:Icons-flag-us.png (Talk • Contribs • CUN) 15:04, Jun. 24, 2008
  • He has been blocked many times. When he gets blocked he just makes another account. Eventually, someone gets suspicious, runs a checkuser, and he gets banned yet again. He makes another account. Rinse and repeat. If we could actually ban him and prevent him from coming back, we should. But since I don't think that is possible, letting him try to clean up his act on here seems like the best course of action for now. One wrong move, ban his ass again. It seems like he really is trying to be helpful, except he is also a dick. Ban him if he becomes a dick. But it's going to continue to be a cycling of banning and account creation, unless he gets bored or we figure out a way to keep him blocked. - UnIdiot | | Talk | Contribs - 18:47, Jun 23
  • Guys? C'mon. He did good. He did nothing but be the same person as NXwave. Qua was a good guy. He has matured. He obviously enjoys Uncyc. Give him another chance.   CAKE J! <20:46, 23 Jun 2008>
  • I'm with Cajek. He will come back no matter what and under his Qua guise he was being productive and probably would have made something of it. Sure we all know who he really is and most people will never get past this but knowing who he is on site is a lot easier than suspecting every noob for the next 111551541 years of being NXWave. He has sort of become the focus of a lot of the hate on uncyc, hell I and Hyperbole weren't around during the NXWave times yet we are still baying for blood. Sure he has acted like a fucktard sooo many times and with so many socks but there is probably no other way to solve it as there will always be proxies and we will always welcome noobs. NXWave has become a by-word for evil. --Sir DJ ~ Irreverent OZ! 14:26, 26 June 2008 (UTC)
  • I remember being driven off for a bit by some of his socks, but still, just forgive his stupidity. He isn't that bad of a person. Hell, if he is range blocked, I'll leave(which won't sway any votes but still.). --Pleb Dexter111344 • Complain here • Vote now! 21:18, 23 June 2008 (UTC)
  • So, Qua was the name he picked. I knew ol' Mordillo was find 'em eventually! I should let you know that I've personally talked to this guy on another website. He's told me he's using better judgement now, and he wishes he could come back to Uncyclopedia with a fresh new life. However, he was said it was unconfortable doing so because "NXWave" is in too deep. He wants the personas of SU182 and NXWave to be burried and long forgotten. "NXWave" has become a name that instantly causes drama, more so than Nin or them others I shouldn't mention, in accordance to the Pandora's Box policy. Yes, yes, he's been a real annoyance in the past, a result of his social problems. I know it's hard to believe that people can change, but I'm willing to put my own less-than-perfect reputation on the line that he's truely a better person. -- Kip teh Dip • Talk • Works • Faq • Vote in '08 • USA! 21:54, Jun. 23, 2008
  • I'll try again. I vote for him to stay, but go under very strict UN:OFFICE policies. When I talked to him, he implied he was going to stay underground and not stir up shit anymore. I kept his secret to prevent drama. However, I also took mercy on him. He reminds me of myself, in that he's been banned alot but wants to come back as a better person out of love for Uncyclopedia. That's why it's such a tough position. I want to clean up my own reputation and not get banned anymore, but at the same time I want others to enjoy Uncyclopedia. I was contemplating starting a campaign to bring AE back, but with Qua here that might not mix well. Hense, the UN:OFFICE rules should apply in that area. So complicated. I want to be a uniter, not a divider. So if he does get to stay, for the sake of being anti-drama I deny any association with him and anything he does. A vote is the only thing I have to do with him. -- Kip teh Dip • Talk • Works • Faq • Vote in '08 • USA! 23:18, Jun. 23, 2008
  • This guy just keeps coming back doesn't he? And you can pretty much guarantee based on what Sannse said below that if we block him, he's just going to come back again. What would that do, it'd cause more drama, and we'd have this all over again. I was surprised Qua was actually NXWave, he's a nice guy, he's made decent contributions and has generally been a nice member of the community. Granted he was a complete and utter fuckface before, but now...I think he's changed. Call me too forgiving, but I think this proves he CAN contribute positively to the community regardless of past actions, and his determinations (Which I quite frankly admire) proves he wants to as well. Based on that, I think he should stay. 12px-Is_loading_3.gif (Bonner) (Talk) Jun 24, 07:08
  • Leave him be. Until he actually starts drama, just let it alone. He's obviously gonna keep coming back so banning him is a waste of time anyway. Give him some editing restrictions, make it clear that we know who he is and we're watching him, and give him a legitimate chance to redeem himself. -OptyC Sucks! Image:Icons-flag-us.png cun17:30, 25 Jun
  • Keep as per Bonner. Even though he made Modus swear. I can get past that. -- Image:smallbeer.pngSpillin DylanImage:smallbeer.pngTALKImage:smallbeer.pngEDITSImage:smallbeer2.png04:39, June 26 2008

General remark regarding the "let him stay we can't block him anyway. That's not a valid reason. If we start saying that, we might as well let every odd vandal who knows how to operate open proxies be, since it's "too much of a hassle". You know what I need to do to ban someone? Click a button. It's not a hassle. We keep tracing him, we keep banning him. It's actually much more of a hassle for him to rebuild himself a new persona each and every time. ~Jewriken.GIF 08:59, 26 June 2008 (UTC)

Banning is easy, I agree. But what's a pain is suspecting every single new user that shows any promise of being a sock. And what if we're wrong at some point? What if some new user that knows a little about wiki formatting and used a proxy to get around a block at their school suddenly finds that they're permabanned with a block reason referencing some user they've never heard of? That's what I'm afraid of. - P.M., WotM, & GUN, Sir Led Balloon (Tick Tock) (Contribs) 17:11, Jun 26

Stays blocked

Score: +18
  • ~Block~ I honestly think 1 sock puppet is OK but 4 sock puppets is a bit much. People should always be given second chances, but it seems NXWave was given this and (although he did do good work) screwed this one up too. The best thing here is to ban his current sock puppet and his entire range if possible. He has 2 indefbanned accounts, scared off people, and evaded bans multiple times. He used up his get out of jail free card. Not that I have anything against him but rules shouldn't be bended until they snap! But what do I know, I'm a cat. --

    Kingkitty Midnight Train ~ Hopium 

16:04, 23 June 2008 (UTC)
  • Infinirange ban - Block his entire range. Anything less would be a deriliction of common sense. He can beg all he wants, but AE was irreplacable. He can go to Encyclopedia Dramatica and be a dick there. Obstain pending further discussion --Nytrospawn 14:45, 24 June 2008 (UTC)
  • Ban. It's downright insulting that a user that ran off another user gets a chance to stay in our community. Besides, he's had far too much of a history. Think Qua is helpful? So was NXWave, if a bit dense when it came to speaking proper English or reviewing articles. Then he created a (now deleted) forum topic and a (now deleted) audio that managed to flame the entire community. I, for one, think he doesn't deserve another chance, and that we ought to put out the flames before they start again. – Sir Skullthumper, MD (criticize • writings • bloggings) Quote of the Day 16:18 Jun 23, 2008
  • I'm not one for giving people chances. ~ Image:Tophatsig.png

    Jacques Pirat, Esq. Converse : Benefactions : U.w.p.

    23/06/2008 @ 16:17
  • I'm all for second or even third chances, and even for turning a blind eye if they're not doing anything wrong, but this guy just can't seem to keep himself in line, even with the million different chances he's had. Rangeblock if possible. • Spang • UotF | talk • 16:35, 23 Jun 2008
  • He joined the first time, and was consistently an ass. He joined a second and tried to be good. Then he went crazy, with the whole NotM fiasco, when he let his ego run amok, mocking another nominated user (scroll down to "I'm so sorry") that was just slightly too old to be a NOTM, if memory serves...all the while knowing full well that he himself wasn't a noob). Also, he ran off AE, which I'll get back to later in this post. Being helpful when he's not being an ass doesn't make up for the fact that he's an ass. Now that it's later in this post, let me say this again, he harrassed a good user to the point that the user left. I generally avoid swearing, and only do so to add emphasis to a statement, so...Fuck him. Sir Modusoperandi 16:50, 23 June 2008 (UTC)
  • Ban Agree with what Modus said. If he'd returned after his first ban and behaved himself - maybe he could stay under close supervision. But he's already proven he can't stick around without violating rule #2, so we'd just be inviting trouble by letting him off again. Ban him. —rc (t) 17:13, 23 June 2008 (UTC)
  • Perma-Block/Range-Block/Whatever it takes. Oh, my. I missed out on a lot of those other accounts, but man. Everybody else has said enough already, I agree with the above stated. He drove away AE? He was a pretty cool guy, if I recall correctly....-- Frankie! (Roman Dog Bird) 17:30, 23 June 2008 (UTC)
  • We actually have already set a precedent for unbanning people; Nintendorulez and The Crack Vandal (remember him?) come to mind immediately. Nintendorulez aside (because he never really asked to come back - recently), The Crack Vandal is probably the only relevant case. The difference though is that The Crack Vandal actually stopped being a dick for awhile, looked around, came on IRC, made it known that he was sorry and wanted to change, and then changed - while under UN:OFFICE mandate. I do not think that this problem can be resolved in the opposite order. Dicks must acknowledge that they are dicks, and want to change. SU182 has never shown me - through his actions and words - that he feels any remorse for his actions (such as driving AE off the wiki) or wants to stop. Therefore, I think we should maintain vigilance and make it clear to SU182 that he is not welcome at Uncyclopedia until further notice (from him, not us, of course). -- Major Sir Zombiebaron GUN • WotM • UotM • PotM • AotM • EGAEDM • UPotM • MAFE • ZotM • IotM • VotM • UGotM (shout) 17:44, 23 June 2008 (UTC)
  • Fuck that shit. We're not dealing with some brainless JASON HALLAMEYA here, he isn't some kid who we can just coerce into being good. This guy is cold, calculating, and harrassing. He will always be a threat, even with strict rules placed on him. He stays gone. --Grand General Wizard Etc x2 and Senator G/K/O/CUNT.K.F. WHORE! ZOTM MAFE VANDL UOTM WOTM TOP10 FP PMOTM UWotM 18:06, 23 June 2008 (UTC)
  • Ban Sure, as a relative newbie, I shouldn't be throwing stones, but seriously. AE was considerably less of a dick than him, and if he actively interferes with other users, not to mention being an arse elsewhere, I'd think the other option would be in order. But coming back under alias... We need a template for people who support a ban, just for the irony. Avy-djgentoo-18px.png DJ Gentoo, now with wit, sarcasm, and more Imperanon. Also in red. 18:10, 23 June 2008 (UTC)
  • Strong ban. I really don't think that someone who ran off a user, came fairly close to running off another, seems to have some sort of award fixation (see: Improver/YTTE NotM controversy, Qua's userpage saying "I hope to .win many awards here"), and generally doesn't seem to be civil should be given an absolute chance. People like Hallameya and Rich (Crack Vandal, for the newbies) actually calmed down and talked to people. I don't see that happening here personally. ―― Sir Heerenveen, KUN [UotM RotM VFH FFS SK CM NS] (talk), 23/06 18:22
  • Get rid. He made Modus swear. I can count on my fingers the number of times I've seen Modus swear. That alone is powerful testimony. Allied to the constant ban evasion, the sockpuppetry, the outbursts of dickishness, the sheer gall of his deceit so many times, the total lack of contrition, the outright hostility shown on several occasions and sundry other offences - frankly, pretty much anything we can do to ensure he goes and stays gone is fine by me (except banning half the interwebs, 'cos knowing my luck it'll be my half). --UU Blah / Pee 18:28, Jun 23
  • Reluctant block I agree with Led that keeping his current account would be a feasible way to keep him from coming back under different aliases, and I really am tired of potential NotM's (Qua and The Improver I took particular interest to, and was thinking of adopting The Improver at the time) having to be suspected every month of sockpuppetry, but think about this. If he stays, what is he to us? Dead weight. He can't be eligible for awards because we know his intentions, there will be a glaring bias against anything he produces that ever gets nominated for anything, and his input into all discussions will be soarly looked down upon. Unfortunately, we've got to ban another sock. Also, per DrS, as his comment definitely swayed me (the way it was worded anyway). Oh and for the record, I never really liked AE all that much (but it doesn't make what NXWave did right). -RAHB 23:14, 23 June 2008 (UTC) Abstain for now. -RAHB 09:19, 24 June 2008 (UTC) Un-abstain. Block I've been giving him too much credit. He's going to keep repeating what he's been doing, and he doesn't deserve the other chance at this point. Regarding the "work" that he's done, it's all been a thinly veiled attempt to win some stupid award. Drove off a user (and flamed countless others I'm not as educated about in the matter I believe) knowingly and willingly, went insane, never once apologized, never once said "I want to change." And he's unlikely too. -RAHB 08:36, 25 June 2008 (UTC)
  • Reluctant block - I changed my vote after looking over the 'evidence' a little more. He's had many chances, but ruined most of them. Sorry to say, but what's done is done. :S - Admiral Enzo Aquarius-Dial the Gate 23:30, 23 June 2008 (UTC)
  • Rangeblock, or the closest we can actually come to it, before we get into the habit of running checkusers on every NotM candidate. I don't know what this guy's deal is, but he and Uncyc can't seem to get along. I might feel differently if he actually ever tried to reconcile with his past, like apologize or explain, but as far as I know he hasn't done anything but sockpuppetry and trying to get an award he knows he doesn't qualify for. --SYNDROME MUN medicate 00:21, 24 June 2008 (UTC)
  • Block that is in no way reluctant - There's something seriously wrong with this guy. I've read his contributions, and you can almost see him going on and off his meds. The guy picked a fight with YTTE, for fuck's sake. Who picks a fight with YTTE? Also, you know what? Oh My God! There's a Meteor Heading Towards Us was a shitty article. Cajek, YTTE, Nyp, and I all tried to fix it, and by the end it still sucked. There isn't even a baby to throw out with the bathwater, here. This is bathwater full of mosquito larvae. Kill it with defenestration. --Hyperbole 00:31, 24 June 2008 (UTC)
  • Block--Sir Sycamore Image:Scotland Flag 1.png (Blether) 13:50, 24 June 2008 (UTC)
  • Block A history of troublemaking that ranges from somewhat irritating to borderline manic. He has proven time and again that he is incapable of being a part of this site without stirring up shit. I'd gladly vote for the banning of every sockpuppet he throws at our site for the next 80 years. --THE 18:47, 24 June 2008 (UTC)

Feed Qua to starving dogs

Score: +3
  • Turning Qua into dog meat could save the lives of several malnourished dogs. It would be immoral not to do this. Image:Icons-flag-au.png Sir Cs1987 UOTM. t. c 04:43, 27 June 2008 (UTC)
  • Hell yeah! Those dogs need nutrition ASAP! --Sir Starnestommy Image:Icons-flag-us.png (Talk • Contribs • CUN) 22:52, Jun. 28, 2008
  • A wild pack of family dogs came running through the yard, as little Qua played. The dogs took him away and I guess he was eaten up, okay, guess he was eaten up, okay. And I'm sitting outside by my mud lake waiting for the pack to take me away; right after I die, the dogs start floatin' up toward the glowing sky. Now they'll receive their rewards now they will receive their rewards now they will receive their rewards. --Hyperbole 21:44, 1 July 2008 (UTC)

Other discussion...?

This is more of a question for sannse, but could NXWave and his affiliates' ranges be blocked without banning half the internet? - Don Leddy the Crunch (Nyah, see, nyah!) 16:25, Jun 23

It depends how wide the range is, and how much collateral damage would be had by blocking it (existing users, potential users). Of course, he could very well have a static IP that could be blocked and be done with. — Sir Manticore progress-wheel.gif 17:07, 23 June 2008 (UTC)
Mhmm...basically, what I'm wondering is, if we decide to ban his whole range permanently, could he still come back? The only reason I didn't vote to get rid of him forever is that blocking him only seems to make him want to come back, and maybe letting him have an account here would put an end to this sockpuppetry thing. If you can really guarantee him being gone for good, though, I'd gladly change my vote. - Don Leddy the Crunch (Nyah, see, nyah!) 17:27, Jun 23
We can't do a range block here - he's already using open proxies. However many of those we block, there will always be more. -- Shiny3.png Shiny2.png Shiny1.png sannse Pretty.png esnnas Shiny1.png Shiny2.png Shiny3.png 18:00, 23 June 2008 (UTC)

This is a question for Qua. What gives? Talk to us. Tell us why we should let you back on the site. I know you can't edit at the moment (at least, not with this account) but rather than going through this whole cycle again, how about mailing me with a reply to paste here? My email address is on my Wikia user page -- Shiny3.png Shiny2.png Shiny1.png sannse Pretty.png esnnas Shiny1.png Shiny2.png Shiny3.png 18:00, 23 June 2008 (UTC)

Or go on IRC. We're always there. Seriously, we never sleep. Avy-djgentoo-18px.png DJ Gentoo, now with wit, sarcasm, and more Imperanon. Also in red. 18:02, 23 June 2008 (UTC)

Since when

Since when do we hold votes to decide if a user gets banned or not? This wouldn't have happened at good old famine's time.---Asteroid B612 (aka Rataube) - Ñ 18:22, 23 June 2008 (UTC)

Good old Famine's time? You mean the time when SU182 first got banned? Look how great that turned out, eh? In my recollection, more drama occurred (Asperger's et al) when Famine was around. Call me crazy, but pining for a golden age that wasn't even a golden age makes no sense whatsoever.~~ Sir Ljlego, GUN  [talk] 22:19, 23 June 2008 (UTC)
Unfortunately, we don't have a guy like Famine on this site anymore. ~ Image:Tophatsig.png

Jacques Pirat, Esq. Converse : Benefactions : U.w.p.

23/06/2008 @ 18:40
Don't blame me, I didn't start this topic. --Grand General Wizard Etc x2 and Senator G/K/O/CUNT.K.F. WHORE! ZOTM MAFE VANDL UOTM WOTM TOP10 FP PMOTM UWotM 18:43, 23 June 2008 (UTC)
Gents, I have no issue with keep banning him from him to eternity, and you might notice that I actually set a very strict scorched earth policy against his previous aliases. However, several admins and users pointed to me in the past that we need to give him a second chance. Therfore, I wanted to end this issue once and for all. Either we get rid of him for good, or we let him stay. Clear cut case. ~Jewriken.GIF 22:17, 23 June 2008 (UTC)
We're having a vote because there's an actual question here. If we let him stay, he might become productive, but if we ban him again he may just come back, worse than ever. This isn't about nostalgia, or even about a guy who is potentially useful. It's about locking him down in one account so he can't just continue to evade bans. I'm fucking tired of suspecting everybody nommed for NotM of being NXWave, and this might be a way to end that. Famine is no longer relevant, nor is nostalgia, or talk about 'the good old days.' Let's take a second to worry about the issue at hand, ok? - Don Leddy the Crunch (Nyah, see, nyah!) 18:47, Jun 23
"If we let him stay, he might become productive". Past experience suggests otherwise. Multiple past experiences. Also, speaking of nostalgia, remember Famine? Ahhhh, good times. Sir Modusoperandi 19:13, 23 June 2008 (UTC)
Nostalgia is not what it used to be anymore.---Asteroid B612